An international team of astronomers working at telescopes i

[lindaliu9273]

Hi Ron,

When I first see the sentence, I suppose there to "An international team of astronomers " follwed by "have detected" determined by "astronomers".

Similar example: A group of students go to the dining hall.

I understand this point is not discussed in this question but it showed something that I want to figure out.

Gmat tests a lot of agreement question of subject with modifier. Sometimes it's quite confusing. Please help.

Thanks a lot!

[RonPurewal]

In U.S. usage, nouns for groups are normally singular.
The faculty is off campus today.
The public is unaware of the threat.

"The police" is always plural. That's the only counterexample I can immediately think of.

These nouns can be plural, but only if the sentence is specifically describing something that each member of the group does/did individually.
A group of students was visible on the street --> Not individual; the whole group was visible.
A group of students were walking on the street --> They were walking individually. There's no such thing as collective walking.

--

[RonPurewal]

MUCH MORE IMPORTANTLY"”"”

This issue (the singular/plural status of "group nouns") will not be tested on the GMAT, unless there is solid proof of whether the noun is singular or plural.

This usage differs from country to country. If it were arbitrarily tested according to the standards of U.S. usage, the test would no longer be a fair test.

As an example of the "proof" I'm talking about, check out #98 in the OG Verbal supplement (blue skinny book).
In that problem, you need to know that "army" is singular to resolve a pronoun issue. However, the problem contains proof that "army" is singular: the pronoun "it" (which is not underlined) stands for the army.

[XinQ919]

Hi Ron,

which one is correct?

(1) A is estimated to have 5 times the mass of B
(2) A is estimated to be 5 times the mass of B

Thank you!

[tim]

First, I believe you have more than enough information to address this question if you read through this whole thread. Second, it is never appropriate to ask "which of these is correct". What if I asked you "which of these is correct: 1+1=2 or 2+2=4?"? Perhaps you can see from this that merely asking the question in this form presupposes that one thing has to be right and the other has to be wrong.

[GraceZ853]

MUCH MORE IMPORTANTLY"”"”

This issue (the singular/plural status of "group nouns") will not be tested on the GMAT, unless there is solid proof of whether the noun is singular or plural.

This usage differs from country to country. If it were arbitrarily tested according to the standards of U.S. usage, the test would no longer be a fair test.

As an example of the "proof" I'm talking about, check out #98 in the OG Verbal supplement (blue skinny book).
In that problem, you need to know that "army" is singular to resolve a pronoun issue. However, the problem contains proof that "army" is singular: the pronoun "it" (which is not underlined) stands for the army.

Ron, I am confused about the usage of mass.
Can we say ''be 5 times Jupiter's mass''? Or can we only say'' have the mass''?
And is ''eastimated at 5 times Jupiter's mass'' right?
Thx in advance!

[RonPurewal]

well, '5 times X's mass' / '5 times the mass of X' is just a mass. it has the same behavior as an explicitly numerical mass, e.g., '100 kilograms'.

so, the basic question is whether it's formally acceptable to write 'Y is/are # units'.
if you have to guess, then 'Y is/are # units' is probably wrong, unless Y is actually a measurement.

nb: DO NOT use informal/spoken/conversational language as a guide here!
in conversation, 'Y is/are # units' is quite common in places where it's not formally correct.
e.g., people commonly SAY things like these:
My brother is only 140 pounds.
She is 6 feet 2 inches.
I can't believe this shirt is a hundred dollars!
all of these are wrong in formal writing. (my brother weighs 140 pounds, the woman is 6'2" tall, and the shirt costs $100.)

on the other hand, if 'Y' is a measurement, then these kinds of constructions are perfectly fine.
e.g.,
If the weight of the package is greater than 25 kilograms, you must pay a heavy-item surcharge.
here, 'Y' = the WEIGHT of the package.
(If the package is over 25 kilograms... is incorrect.)