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devesh_la
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use of list in GMAT SC

by devesh_la Wed Jun 03, 2009 2:34 am

It has been said that all one can do for a sprained ankle is leave it alone while it heals itself, ice it, and to lie with it in a slightly elevated position

(A) all one can do for a sprained ankle is leave it alone while it heals itself, ice it, and to
(B) all one can do for a sprained ankle is to leave it alone to heal itself, to ice it, and
(C) all one can do for a sprained ankle is leave it alone while it heals itself, and then ice it and
(D) the only thing that can be done for a sprained ankle is leave it alone while it heals itself, ice it, and
(E) the only thing that can be done for a sprained ankle is to leave it alone while it heals itself, to ice it, and
------------------------------------------------------------------
It is an oversimplified view of cattle raising to say that all one has to do with cattle is leave them alone while they feed themselves, corral them, and to drive them to market when the time is ripe.

(A) all one has to do with cattle is leave them alone while they feed themselves, corral them, and to
(B) all one has to do with cattle is to leave them alone to feed themselves, to corral them, and
(C) all one has to do with cattle is leave them alone while they feed themselves and then corral them and
(D) the only thing that has to be done with cattle is leave them alone while they feed themselves, corral them, and
(E) the only thing that has to be done with cattle is to leave them alone while they feed themselves, to corral them, and

As per the official answers, its D and C.

I have checked a many forums to understand the reason for different OA. Both the sentence construction are same .. so what should be final answer and why??
stock.mojo11
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Re: use of list in GMAT SC

by stock.mojo11 Thu Jun 04, 2009 5:47 pm

care to underline the SC question?

No underline - no answer.

C mon, every one else's time is valuable just like yours is
devesh_la
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Re: use of list in GMAT SC

by devesh_la Fri Jun 05, 2009 11:58 am

It has been said that all one can do for a sprained ankle is leave it alone while it heals itself, ice it, and to lie with it in a slightly elevated position

(A) all one can do for a sprained ankle is leave it alone while it heals itself, ice it, and to
(B) all one can do for a sprained ankle is to leave it alone to heal itself, to ice it, and
(C) all one can do for a sprained ankle is leave it alone while it heals itself, and then ice it and
(D) the only thing that can be done for a sprained ankle is leave it alone while it heals itself, ice it, and
(E) the only thing that can be done for a sprained ankle is to leave it alone while it heals itself, to ice it, and
------------------------------------------------------------------
It is an oversimplified view of cattle raising to say that all one has to do with cattle is leave them alone while they feed themselves, corral them, and to drive them to market when the time is ripe.

(A) all one has to do with cattle is leave them alone while they feed themselves, corral them, and to
(B) all one has to do with cattle is to leave them alone to feed themselves, to corral them, and
(C) all one has to do with cattle is leave them alone while they feed themselves and then corral them and
(D) the only thing that has to be done with cattle is leave them alone while they feed themselves, corral them, and
(E) the only thing that has to be done with cattle is to leave them alone while they feed themselves, to corral them, and

As per the official answers, its D and C.

I have checked a many forums to understand the reason for different OA. Both the sentence construction are same .. so what should be final answer and why??
RonPurewal
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Re: use of list in GMAT SC

by RonPurewal Thu Jun 11, 2009 6:39 am

it seems that you're concentrating on the first parts of these choices.
that's a mistake, since the first parts are based on word choice (which is not a grammatical issue), while the last parts are based on parallelism (which IS a grammatical issue).

TAKEAWAY:
ALWAYS concentrate on genuinely GRAMMATICAL issues, such as parallelism, FIRST.
save things such as word choice for last.



also, i'd bet big money that the first of these problems is an imitation (there are at least 3 problems with it - see below), while the second seems to be authentic.

--

#1
devesh_la Wrote:It has been said that all one can do for a sprained ankle is leave it alone while it heals itself, ice it, and to lie with it in a slightly elevated position

(A) all one can do for a sprained ankle is leave it alone while it heals itself, ice it, and to
(B) all one can do for a sprained ankle is to leave it alone to heal itself, to ice it, and
(C) all one can do for a sprained ankle is leave it alone while it heals itself, and then ice it and
(D) the only thing that can be done for a sprained ankle is leave it alone while it heals itself, ice it, and
(E) the only thing that can be done for a sprained ankle is to leave it alone while it heals itself, to ice it, and


note that ALL THREE OF THE DESCRIBED ACTIONS ARE PARALLEL.
they are also simultaneous.
therefore, they should come in one list. note, below, that this is NOT the case for the three actions in the second example that you've posted.

note that in the list
X, Y, and Z
the "Y" and "Z" parts are "locked in" by the signals that come to their LEFT (i.e., the comma, and the comma + "and").
therefore, look to these two first. if they're parallel, then look to the "X" part (which is more flexible, since there is no signal word to its left) and see whether you can find a match for the "Y" and "Z" parts.

(a)
"Y" = ice it (no "to")
"Z" = TO lie with it
not parallel

(b)
"Y" = TO ice it
"Z" = lie with it (no "to")
not parallel

(c)
* the 3 verbs should all come in one list, but they don't. the writing of this sentence falsely suggests that only the last 2 verbs are parallel, and that the first action is separate and previous to those two.

* there should not be a comma after "itself". if it's "X and then Y", there should be no comma after X.

(d)
correct
Y = "ice it", Z = "lie with it". these are properly parallel, and also parallel to X = "leave it...".
all 3 are grammatically parallel, as required.

(e)
"Y" = TO ice it
"Z" = lie with it (no "to")
not parallel

let it be known that this is a crappy problem, though. first of all, "the only thing" is sloppy, since 3 things are actually mentioned. second, "the only thing is leave" is unidiomatic; you'd have to use the full infinitive (...is TO leave). third, the word "thing" itself is uncomfortably informal.
sigh.
whoever is writing these things should seriously step their game up. i swear.

--

#2
It is an oversimplified view of cattle raising to say that all one has to do with cattle is leave them alone while they feed themselves, corral them, and to drive them to market when the time is ripe.

(A) all one has to do with cattle is leave them alone while they feed themselves, corral them, and to
(B) all one has to do with cattle is to leave them alone to feed themselves, to corral them, and
(C) all one has to do with cattle is leave them alone while they feed themselves and then corral them and
(D) the only thing that has to be done with cattle is leave them alone while they feed themselves, corral them, and
(E) the only thing that has to be done with cattle is to leave them alone while they feed themselves, to corral them, and


note that THESE THREE ACTIONS ARE NOT ALL SIMULTANEOUS OR CONCEPTUALLY PARALLEL. THEREFORE, THEY SHOULD NOT BE PLACED IN ONE LIST.
instead,
the first action is separate (since this action occurs before "the time is ripe"), and the latter two actions should be written together (since these two things occur when "the time is ripe").

(a) = double wrong
* all 3 verbs are ostensibly parallel; they shouldn't be.
* "corral" and "to drive" aren't properly parallel anyway.

(b) = double wrong
* all 3 verbs are ostensibly parallel; they shouldn't be.
* "to corral" and "drive" aren't properly parallel anyway.

(c)
correct
this sentence properly groups "corral" and "drive" SEPARATELY from "leave them alone".
the parallelism is also good.

(d)
* these 3 verbs should not be in one list
* "thing" is uncomfortably informal
* "the only thing" is sloppy, since 3 "things" are mentioned
* "the only thing is leave" is unidiomatic; you'd have to use the full infinitive (...is TO leave)

(e)
* these 3 verbs should not be in one list
* "to corral" and "drive" aren't properly parallel anyway
* "thing" is uncomfortably informal
* "the only thing" is sloppy, since 3 "things" are mentioned
pmal04
 
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Re: use of list in GMAT SC

by pmal04 Fri Jul 24, 2009 11:19 am

Hi Ron,
In #2-choice C(correct ans), GMAT did not use full infinitive (...is TO leave).
However, you said for choice D(incorrect) that "the only thing is leave" is unidiomatic; you'd have to use the full infinitive (...is TO leave).

How choice C is correct with an unidiomatic expression?
Thanks,
RonPurewal
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Re: use of list in GMAT SC

by RonPurewal Wed Aug 05, 2009 8:35 pm

pmal04 Wrote:Hi Ron,
In #2-choice C(correct ans), GMAT did not use full infinitive (...is TO leave).
However, you said for choice D(incorrect) that "the only thing is leave" is unidiomatic; you'd have to use the full infinitive (...is TO leave).

How choice C is correct with an unidiomatic expression?
Thanks,


not unidiomatic in this case.

if it's described as a "thing", then you have to use the full infinitive.
this is because the infinitive itself can be (and often is) used in the place of a noun, as in constructions such as to err is human.
if you don't have the "to" in front, then it's a genuine verb - not an infinitive - and so can't be described as a "thing".

if you have a sentence that starts with "all one has to do", then a verb is fine, since we're not calling anything a "thing" anymore.
RonPurewal
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Re: use of list in GMAT SC

by RonPurewal Wed Aug 05, 2009 8:37 pm

...and also, the word "thing" isn't very good formal written english in the first place.

i would wager some money that there hasn't been an official problem with "thing" in the correct answer - just too informal.
i'm not 100% sure of this, but i would be surprised if someone were to post such a problem.