Q19 - Editor Y: This is a good photograph

[ohthatpatrick]

Question Type:
ID the Disagreement

Stimulus Breakdown:
Y: Good photo. Composition is attractive, particularly the blurry, smokey corner.
Z: Bad photo. Very pretty, but smoke has no obvious purpose, and the photo doesn't make a statement.

Answer Anticipation:
It's easy to find the explicit disagreement: good vs. bad photograph. That normally means that LSAT will go one level deeper and use the reasons WHY the speakers came to differing conclusions. Z seems to feel that a photo needs to make a statement to be good, so it seems likely that LSAT might test that idea.

Correct Answer:
D

Answer Choice Analysis:
(A) No comment from Y on whether composition should be related to a statement.

(B) Not applicable to this conversation, since both authors think the photo is attractive

(C) No, they're not discussing the connection between making a statement and being atractive, but rather between making a statement and being "good/bad".

(D) Yes! Y seems to call this photo good, simply because it's attractive. Z seems to agree that it's attractive but not feel that it's a good photograph (because it makes no statement)

(E) Neither person is making this extreme/weird claim.

Takeaway/Pattern: When there is obvious, explicit disagreement, the correct answer usually uses the supporting reasons. When one author employs a harsh, limiting rule, like "If it doesn't make a statement, it's can't be good", then you can express the opposite with a counterexample, like (D) does.

#officialexplanation

[jardinsouslapluie5]

Is Y only considering "attractiveness" to be a good photograph?
I thought this could be just one of the many factors.
So I couldn't narrow it to be "attractiveness" is the only criteria that Y is considering this is a good photograph.

[nancychannc]

I think there's an implied conditional statement in what Editor Y says:

The composition is attractive -> This is a good photograph.

[ericha3535]

Are authors agreeing on C?

By reading argument Z, we could see that whatever photo they are viewing does not have a statement.

But, Y claimed that such photo is attractive despite of lack of the photo. Thus Y would agree with C.

Z would agree with C because Z does claim that photo is attractive or pretty.

Am I wrong?

[ohthatpatrick]

Whenever I do an Identify the Disagreement question, I pick something the 1st person said that the 2nd person would disagree with.

So which of these ideas does the 2nd person disagree with:
- good photograph
- composition is attractive
- smoke blur in corner is especially attractive
???

2nd person disagrees with "good photograph" ... he says "bad photograph".

(2nd person agrees with "attractive" / "very pretty" and makes no comment about whether the smoke blur is especially attractive.)

So as I head towards the answer choices, I'm looking for something about "whether or not it's a good/bad photograph".

This immediately filters out (A), (C), and (E), none of which hinge on the question of whether or not something is a good/bad photograph.

Between (B) and (D), I have to eliminate (B) because the two people were discussing a photograph that IS attractive, so this statement has no bearing on their discussion.

(D) is definitely not my favorite phrasing. I'm fairly confident that Z disagrees with (D), because Z acknowledges the photo is attractive, but concludes that the photo is bad. So for Z, attractiveness alone is not enough.

(Technically, though, we only know that Z would say "attractiveness is not always sufficient to make a photo good" ... Z might believe that some photos are good purely based on their attractiveness)

I'm fairly worried about accusing Y of relying ONLY on attractiveness to reach the conclusion of "good photo". But as a previous poster incisively noted, the use of a colon indicates a definitional/explanatory connection.

for example,
This is a good investment: the benefits far outweigh the risks.

So Y seems to be judging the photo's goodness based on the attractiveness.

Hence, (D) is the correct answer.

But I share most people's qualms about how poorly worded (D) is. The only thing making it easy to pick (D) is that the disagreement is purely about good vs. bad photograph. Only (B) and (D) qualify to weigh in on that debate, and (B) doesn't pertain to this attractive photo.

In terms of the previous question about whether they would agree on (C), we wouldn't be able to say whether or not Y agrees that the photo makes no statement, so we couldn't pick (C).

By contrast, we can pick (D) as a disagree because they BOTH discussed whether it was attractive and BOTH discussed whether it was good.

Hope this helps.

[ganbayou]

Can I say Editor Y says: attractive=>good, and Editor Z says statement=>good, so they are disagreeing with each other about what makes a good photo?
So, the answer is D, but B switch the suff and nec condition, so it's wrong for Editor Y either.
Would this interpretation correct?

Thank you

[ohthatpatrick]

Close, but Z does not give us enough to say

Makes a statement --> Good.

It gives us enough to say

DOESN'T make a statement --> Bad.

The contrapositive would read
Good --> Makes a statement

Or, conversationally, "in order for a photo to be good, it NEEDS to make a statement". But that doesn't imply that making a statement is sufficient.

Since Y and Z are talking about a photo they both agree is attractive, it's hard to say that (B) is anywhere near the conversation.

We're hearing their thoughts on this attractive photo, with differing interpretations about whether or not it's a good photo.

We really have no idea how either Editor feels about "unattractive" photos.

[kyuya]

I hate these disagreement Q's.

Break down the two arguments:

Y
- good photograph.. why?
- composition is attractive

Editor Z

- bad photograph..why?
- makes no statement

Obviously they disagree over whether the photo is good or not. But of course the correct AC is not worded this way.

(A) We don't really know what "Y" thinks about a statement, so we cannot say she thinks about it a certain way.

(B) Neither of them speak on NOT attractive photographs, we cannot say they disagree over it.

(C) Again, we don't know what Y thinks about statements. Perhaps he thinks this photograph DOES make a statement, or DOES NOT. Since we don't know, this cannot be right .

(D)

Editor Z states that its a bad photograph, even though it is pretty.
Editor Y states that it is a good photograph because it is attractive.

In other words, Z must think it is sufficient to be a good photo because it is the only support he uses for his argument. Likewise, Y makes it clear that being a good photo transcends merely being attractive.

This is the right answer.

(E) Y states that the photo is pretty because of composition; he does not conflate them
Z states NOTHING about composition.. so how could he believe they are the same thing.


I think the wrong answer choices hinge on things not being mentioned at all, so we cannot really say they are disagreeing about it. Quick references back to their arguments to scan for certain words can be helpful, although you should also be careful because at times it is reasonable to infer something is being supported or not in an argument without it being explicitly said.

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